Topics: Gambling advertising
Michael McLaren: Sarah Henderson’s with me. Sarah, happy Easter to you.
Senator Henderson: Michael, good afternoon and a very happy Easter to you and your listeners.
Michael McLaren: I was getting texts yesterday when I mentioned this, Sarah, people say, Look, I’m a rusted-on Liberal voter because I’m further right than Genghis Khan. But then they’d say, you know, I’ve got kids and I’ve got grandkids. I’m sick and tired of having betting, betting, betting in their face when they’re watching sport, when they’re listening to sport, when they’re on social media, on the jerseys of their idols, on the ground, visual advertising displays. They say we’re drowning in the saturation. And these are conservatives or self-confessed conservatives saying, you know what? Time for a change. I guess that is the Liberals’ position still, isn’t it?
Senator Henderson: Well, we welcome the action on gambling harm which, of course, was announced yesterday by the Prime Minister. But as you say, Michael, it should not have taken more than 1000 days for the Prime Minister to act. There is no doubt that gambling addiction is tearing apart many Australian families, many communities and the need for reform has been clear for a number of years. But we have seen this Prime Minister delaying, denying, deflecting in the face of some pretty alarming statistics, Michael, because, as you say, gambling advertising is very much targeted towards young people. Australians are exposed to around 1 million gambling ads each year and we are particularly concerned about this impact, the impact that this has on children. Would you believe Michael, around 600,000 underage teenagers aged between 12 to 17 are gambling an estimated $18 million every year. So it is an alarming trend and we do need to act.
Michael McLaren: Now look, I’m on board. But semantics, I think, also matter, Sarah, in this debate. So, we often talk about gambling losses and that has a negative connotation. But a lot of people, you know, there’s a lot of people who have a punt on this or they play the pokies, maybe even once a week. They don’t view that as a loss, even if they don’t take home more money than they spend, they say, well, look, that’s how I get my enjoyment. It’s not at a loss. It’s an expense. In the same way that they might look at the people that spend $350 to get an A-grade seat to the opera and say, well, geez, you blew that money. Why would you want to see all that foreign nonsense? So, semantics matter. Not every bet is a loss in that loaded sense of the term, even if you don’t walk away with the money that you started with.
Senator Henderson: Well, Michael, we are concerned about gambling addiction, the harm that gambling addiction causes to so many Australians, and we will carefully scrutinise this announcement and we’ve already highlighted the fact that, would you believe, Michael, we announced a policy to extend the gambling advertising blackout on television three years ago and in a gross act of hypocrisy, the Prime Minister and the Labor Party opposed our sensible measure. The other thing that’s emerged out of this is that the Prime Minister is talking big on gambling reform and yet he made an announcement saying, ‘Oh, we will reform the law with a complete ban during live sport broadcasts between 6am and 8:30pm’.
Now, the fact of the matter is, there has been a ban on gambling ads during live sport for many years and when we were in government back in 2017, we strengthened those laws. So, the Prime Minister has said something and told Australian something yesterday, which is completely wrong, I would say deliberately misleading. But again, you know, I think Australians are used to the fact that they cannot trust this Prime Minister and that is just one more example.
Michael McLaren: I think I’m right in saying, Sarah, that the average Australian is on board with change so well, what you say, I appreciate we’ll park the politics though and say, let’s look at the issue. Most people, I think, not everyone, but a lot of people say, look, okay, we’re heading in the right direction here. The Greens are saying we haven’t gone far enough. People like Tim Costello welcome the acknowledgement but they say, look, we need a total ban. I’m a small government kind of guy but I realise there’s a role for government here. I don’t think a total ban is required. Where’s the Coalition sitting on this debate about total ban on advertising, as opposed to restrictions on gambling advertising?
Senator Henderson: Well, we want to get the balance right. We respect the fact that Australians have every right to have a bet, whether it’s on the races, on any other sport and so we don’t want to turn Australia into a nanny state. So, it is about getting the balance right. And I do think that most Australians would welcome further measures to restrict gambling ads, particularly targeted towards children. But I do raise the concern, and yesterday, one of the announcements was that gambling advertising will be banned online for children under 18, after the fiasco with the social media ban, when that is clearly not working. Many children are finding work around under that measure. I am really concerned that the government is big on the talk, big on the announcement but very poor on the delivery. So, we do raise concerns about whether they can put that sort of ban into place.
Michael McLaren: Okay, I made this point earlier. I wouldn’t mind your take on this, Sarah, and that is on the lack of consistency in Australian politics when it comes to potential vices or harm and the way that we deal with or politically control advertising. Now, for example, smoking, we know that’s no good for you, still a legal product for those over eighteen but there’s a blanket ban on advertising. Can’t advertise. Alcohol arguably does more damage to the economy and individuals than smoking and yet, there’s not that much by way of restriction for alcohol advertising. We’ve now got gambling. We’re going to have some restrictions. But the point, I guess, is there’s no consistency here between vice and rules around advertising. It seems each individual is being treated differently, that can lead to confusion, right?
Senator Henderson: Well, I’m not sure about that, Michael, because smoking, of course, no matter how many cigarettes one might smoke a day, we know that causes harm, even if it’s one cigarette a day. So, parliament, over the years, have made decisions based on relative harm, whether it’s alcohol, whether it’s tobacco, or whether it’s gambling addiction. Let’s just focus on the fact that these reforms are targeted at those Australians with gambling addiction problems, which can cause enormous harm in the community. This is not about saying to Australians, you can’t have a bet. This is not about, you know, saying to Australians you can’t go to the local races and enjoy a day out.
We know that this industry supports many thousands of jobs and so it’s very important for the Coalition that we do get the balance right. But we are concerned that there is enormous growth in the targeting of children in particular, that is very much our concern, as I mentioned. And the Alliance for gambling reform has done some very significant work. It has found, for instance, that among men, young men, the trend is very concerning. So more than a quarter of men aged between 18 and 24 and 1/3 of men aged up to 34 now bet on sport, so they are really being targeted. And it’s the evidence shows that nearly one in five young sports betters are already showing signs of problem gambling. So that’s what we are trying to address here.
And as I say, it is about getting the balance right but very, very unfortunately, the Prime Minister, very hypocritical, is now supporting a policy very similar to what we announced three years ago, rather than take action three years ago. And he’s also misleading Australians by saying he’s acting on banning ads during live sport, when, of course, we strengthen those laws many years ago. So, a lot of smoke and mirrors.
Michael McLaren: Yeah, I guess he wants to own it, even if he didn’t really give birth to it. I want to talk to you also about the defence issue. We’re out of time. Let’s do that maybe next week or the week after, when things settle down, because that is obviously still ongoing. That whole estate sale. And as you know, we’ve been trying to save Victoria barracks up here. You’ve been doing some wonderful work for some of the significant sites in your home state of Victoria. So we’ll do that at our next opportunity. If that’s okay, Sarah.
Senator Henderson: That would be wonderful. Just go to my website, Save Fort Queenscliff. We’re running a petition and we have announced that if the Coalition is elected, we will keep Fort Queenscliff and Swan Island in Commonwealth hands. So we’re making some very good progress but love to chat to you more about that.
Michael McLaren: We’ll do that. Thank you. Happy Easter again, Sarah Henderson.